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Red Sondors 60V 750Watts project

 

Starting a new thread for the Sondors Red  fat bike 60V 17.5ah battery, 35a controller, 750Watts motor, 7 speeds project. 

Should I lace the motor to new rims? Should I use the stock rims? Should I consider a switch to 27.5 Plus rims? How about a suspension fork?

other upgrades for consideration, Brakes, Handlebar, Seat, Tires.

Wonder how fast or how far?

Stay tuned for more pictures and detailed progress reports. Appreciate your comments and input as this project gets underway.

 

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Edited by Houshmand Moarefi
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Neat stuff!  Tell me about your thinking on the 740mm handlebar.  I have been wondering about moving wider from the stock 660mm width that I stuck with when I replaced my bar with a carbon fiber wunderbar.  Having issues with wrist pain and wondering if a wider bar would help (am already not locking my arms when riding).

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Matt,  even though I am only 5-8, I do have broad shoulders (wear size 43 jackets).  As the result, I always feel more comfortable with wider bars whether on MTN or Road bikes.  I have a 44cm FSA bar on my Cannondale road bike and generally ride on 700mm+ 1" riser on my mountain bikes.  Wider bars allow for more spread arm and hand position, easier breathing (opens your chest)  and less strain on shoulder, arms and wrist if combined with ergonomic grips and appropriate seat and stem heights to accommodate your body geometry.  The stock Sondors handlebar feels too narrow and cramp to me.

 

Earlier today when I was riding the Red bike which is essentially stock, it felt cramp and smaller than my dual drive even though it's the same size frame.  The dual drive has a 760mm handlebar, adjustable stem, a narrow and longer MTB style seat and Ergon grips.  It completely feels like a different bike.

 

on another note, going from the dual drive to a stock bike highlights the power and torque of our dual drive bikes. While the red bike is  not capable of the power we are now used to, I was able to pedal it to 24 mph on a completely flat road. I was never able to go above 21 when my black bike was stock. I guess 5000 miles of riding in 1.5 years has made me more fit and in better shape. 

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Hi, i have got the 750 watt motor , the 35amp controller, L3 battery. After speaking to my local bike shop we decided to keep the stock rim but use Sapim strong spokes cut to the correct size. This should be a lot stronger than stock. All i need now is a derailer for the rear and a 7 speed changer and i will be done.

Will be interested to see how your 60v battery works out.

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@Houshmand MoarefiI chose to build my new wheels, for my 750watt upgrade, in the most robust manner. I bought double wall rims: 100mm rear and 80mm front, quality offerings abound sporting many logos, although I suspect they all come from one or two Chinese factories.  I also bought Sapim 12 gauge spokes (specified in the 750watt data sheet) and long brass/silver nipples from yojimbos garage in suburban Chicago.  http://stores.ebay.com/Yojimbos-Garage-Chicago-lbs using a combination of an online spoke calculator and wall chart @ Bike Shop Ben's to calculate spoke lengths.

Most bike shops are more comfortable specifying the same spokes they use to build wheels for 20 to 30 pound road and MTBs.  I ordered the custom cut and rolled thread spokes on Tuesday and recieved them on that Thursday because Jim delivered them to his post office on the day I ordered them, quite incredible service I thought. Housmand, I noticed that Coco's in Denver, discovered they had to use spoke head washers on your original 750watt build to insure the spoke heads didn't pull through the larger spoke holes in the Bafang 750watt hub flange holes. The end result of my wheel build choices in combination with the tire choices: Vee Rubber 26x4.7 Mission Command Rear and Vee Rubber 26x4.0 Vee Rubber Mission Control Front, was the correct choice for my builds giving me bullet proof wheels and quick handeling and low rolling resistance for my mostly hard pack and pavement riding and routes. Wheel builds boil down to personal choices based on intended use and desire,  YMMV.

As the owner of a fleet of classic and varied bicycles collected over the last 40 years I can align with your desire to build a stable of high performance Sondors and look forward to developments as they ...ah...develope. )) 

Edited by Tabletteer
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@Tabletteer I like your thinking.  A few questions:

Why hey did you go with 100mm rear and 80mm front? What's the advantage?

would you please share the link to your rim?

for similar reasons you are describing, Jake at CoCo's went with Black DT Swiss spokes.  

Have you start a thread thread for your 750 Watts upgrade project. Would love to see the pictures of the finished product and learn more from your experience.

 

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@Houshmand Moarefi, My Sondors is neither the Mountain Climbing Monster, that you have created (kudos) nor a stop light, to stop light street racer, rather my daily errand and urban assult vecihicle that I also plan for long distant camping trips (not there yet). I reasons that I wanted the large wide footprint, that the 100mm rear wheel (wider than the stock Sondors) affords for a couple of three reasons. I often carry very heavy loads on my bike on my 20mile average trips into town. I have the option of two different sets of panniers (lg & sm) depending on that day's mission. I grocery shop, haul 40# bags Rachel Ray Dog Food about once a month and with the heaver 750watt Bafang and a rear rack mounted 52v-14ah, heavy battery that I suspended under my rear rack, requiring widening it 3/8 of an inch (not much but a ton of work) to leave the custom fabricated top platform, wide and sturdy (planning another 52v triangle battery in the box). I also plan to tow a lightweight trailer when I travel and camp. And lastly I thought it looked good.)) 

I also remembered that you said you'd wished you'd used 80mm rims on your initial 750w upgrade posting (might have been in a PM to me). I also didn't like the slow, cumbersome, self steering of the stock fat tires and with the slight difference in height, rake and trail, of the new narrower front 26x4.0 Mission Control folding bead 120tpi Vee Rubber tire on the 80mm rim, I solved that problem and for both reasons, I was guided to the quick handeling that the bike now exhibits. 

Front Rim, Double Wall, Down Hill 80: http://www.niagaracycle.com/categories/weinmann-rim-26-dhl80mm-36h-black

Rear Rim, Double Wall, Down Hill 100: http://www.ebay.com/itm/361334354530 

But either of these rims are offered under different names and logos all over the interweb and none will accomidate the 12 gauge spokes until you drill out the spoke holes and carefully hone both edges with a stone....another reason your LBS doesn't like 12 gauge spokes.....I love the Minutia. 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/121365040049

i made my tire choices after a considerable amount of research and finally decided on the Newer Vee Rubber Mission Controll offerings. Most fat tire reviews are the polar opposite for my riding style and needs and some reviewers loved and others disliked these tires because of the common low tire pressure they test at, but they are fast rolling, low rolling resistant with a universal combination tread pattern biased toward hard pack and pavement for a real fat tire and I ride at high pressure with no flats, but everybody has their favorite tire.  I bought both sizes in folding bead 120tpi from excelcycle in Minnesota but their link no longer works and the site reference on the interweb states permanently closed, but all the other online regular suspects offer them.  

I will compile the build info when finished but I am guided by the Turtle not the Hare...I'm rather slow as have been my decisions and thoughtful attention to detail....for instance, I dislike zip ties and molded new cable guides, for the derailleur cable, to the frame, so even running the housing took several days.                                              

Electric Black Lightningimage.thumb.jpeg.f7f8db155d2a3ae2513fd773bf0a0ae4.jpeg

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Yes, Jake chose 2.0mm,14 gauge DT Swiss spokes for your build but I preferred the thicker, black, 2.3mm 12 gauge versions by Sapim. Wheelsmith, DT Swiss, Sapim or Phil Wood spokes are all of equal quality. I'll compile more info in the short term but I have a few items left and my headlight is giving me fits to mount esthetically, before I post the whole build.

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