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3D-vice

The 100%-Legality Project (for Germany)

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Alrighty... I'm almost back from the dead and my neck ist recovering slowly but steadily, yay.

A few days ago, I got my laced rims back from Whizz Wheels and the look pretty good... damn those 100mm wide rims look FAT for sure. Here are some pics.

SondorsOwnersForum_NewRims.thumb.jpg.f0e588ffbb1b32c2deb73b6bac36fb83.jpg

Next I'll attach disc brakes, etc. and set all up for exchanging the wheels. I'm very curious who my bike will look (and ride) then.

Edited by 3D-vice
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Bout time you got back to work here.))  Lots of your countrymen are looking for answers. 

Glad you're back up and pedaling, the hive just ain't the same when you're gone.

Edited by Tabletteer
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... aaand on we go: Tires mounted on rims, 203mm brake discs installed. Have a look:

SondorsOwnersForum_NewTires.thumb.jpg.cfb2d6c56c5aaad2834b646f6b0dfe42.jpg

While checking the original rear freewheel on the Sondors, I recognized that the original single speed freewheel is much closer to the rear dropout than the new one installed on the new hub motor. While comparing the two hub motors with each other, I learend that the new hub motor had a slightly different hull- and axle-design than the original on, causing the new single speed freewheel to sit much closer to the hub motor body than the original one. I realized that this might be a problem when using my new 100mm wide rims, because the chain might rub against the tire and it might not run in a straight line from the front chainring to the rear sprocket.

SondorsOwnersForum_NewFreewheel.thumb.jpg.901bda45c8c9121b39da3f9fc270140b.jpg

I did some Googleing and learned that there are spacers available for those threaded single speed freewheels. After half an hour of not finding any manufacturer of those spacers, I stumbled over good old LunaCycle and - tadaaah - they sell them. Have a look:

SondorsOwnersForum_NewFreewheelSpacer.thumb.jpg.a86519415e65be3f91c1245bfe09500b.jpg

So... waiting for delivery... (initiate elevator music) ;)

 

Edited by 3D-vice
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Arrrgh.  I hate to say it buddy, but you got the wrong one.  The Luna part is a good one, but as you no doubt have already guessed (or at least I hope so) freewheel tools don't work on a 750w motor due to the captured bolts and inability to fit the removal tool over/around them, or even the motor plug.  This means that freewheel removal is a major headache just like it was with the el cheapo 350w setup,  You are back to using hammers and punches etc.  Possibly even destructive removal and replacement.

The Luna spacer does not have something that the EBikeKit spacer does have:  Wrench flats

https://www.ebikekit.com/products/freewheel-spacer-for-1-speed

dsc_7870.jpg?v=1472802385

This allows you to use a (big) crescent wrench to loosen the entire freewheel+spacer assembly, which comes right off and then you can separate the freewheel from it as needed  by placing the spacer in a vise and THEN using your removal tool and a wrench on it.

This spacer solves the one major, otherwise insoluble problem of the 750 motor.

Unless you've figured something out?  You'd be the first to come up with something different than the above.

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On 4/2/2017 at 10:42 PM, 3D-vice said:

There are way too many gray areas concerning eBikes, indeed. And looking at the latest changes of regulations, I assume the people responsible for them also lack a certain level of knowledge.

In Europe it are stupid laws that kills the ebike!

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Matt is 3-D's 250watt replacment motor spindle the same as the 750watt motor? Or is this yet another iteration of the design. Looks like 3D is deep in the R&D phase of yet another new conversion process. 

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On 26.6.2017 at 3:40 PM, MattRobertson said:

Arrrgh.  I hate to say it buddy, but you got the wrong one.  The Luna part is a good one, but as you no doubt have already guessed (or at least I hope so) freewheel tools don't work on a 750w motor due to the captured bolts and inability to fit the removal tool over/around them, or even the motor plug.  This means that freewheel removal is a major headache just like it was with the el cheapo 350w setup,  You are back to using hammers and punches etc.  Possibly even destructive removal and replacement.

The Luna spacer does not have something that the EBikeKit spacer does have:  Wrench flats

https://www.ebikekit.com/products/freewheel-spacer-for-1-speed

This allows you to use a (big) crescent wrench to loosen the entire freewheel+spacer assembly, which comes right off and then you can separate the freewheel from it as needed  by placing the spacer in a vise and THEN using your removal tool and a wrench on it.

This spacer solves the one major, otherwise insoluble problem of the 750 motor.

Unless you've figured something out?  You'd be the first to come up with something different than the above.

As a famous quote by Homer Simpson says: DOH! ;) Hey man, you got a valid point there! I realized the lack of wrench flats or similar removal tool attachment points on the Luna spacer, but I ordered it anyway due to not having other alternatives at that point (or me being to stupid to propperly earch the interweb, hehehe).

Thanks for the link! I think I'll get this one, too, then I can compare both and give you guys some feedback.

@Tabletteer That is indeed a good question concerning the motor spindle. Since the hull design of the 250W and the 350W motor differ, it would be interesting to know if there are futher design differences between those and the 750W motor casing.

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The difference between the two looks like a Vice and a Flat File or 4" Makita angle grinder. 

For the rest of the build and discovering the differences between the 250 & 750 watt motors:  The obvious choice to solve that quandry would be to get your 250watt certified (the process is so complicated and nomenclature so different that I can't recal all you are doing) but as soon as you have the documentation, install the 750 and reap the benifit of the of the wind in your hair (assuming that you've still got some) and the pavement rushing beneath your feet.)) 

I know, I know, the whole endeavor is the based on 100% Legality Project and so my Electric Black Lightning is also, as long as I don't use the throttle to go faster than the 20mph limit on speed using said throttle in the Lone Star State....and I don't! But there is this slight downhill of about a eighth of a mile (200 meters) before the last turn off before entering my drive to my forest home that temps me every ride.....but in my defense I don't always give into temptation. )) 

 

Edited by Tabletteer

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SondorsOwnersForum_FreewheelSpacer.thumb.jpg.d857436fbbd05edb3f3a6c36e3ff4988.jpg

So I finally got the freewheel spacer. As you can see, in the original build, the distance of the single speed freewheel to the motor casing (B1) is about 7-8 mm and the distance to the rear dropout (A1) is about 5 mm, aligning the freewheel in a straight line to the front chainring.

As you can see in the closeup picture in my above post from June 25, the new freewheel was way to close to the motor casing and way to far away from the rear dropout, resulting in a misalignment. The new freewheel spacer did a good job here: It moved the freewheel away from the motor casing (B2) and positioned it at a similar distance to the rear dropout (A2) as in the original build.

As soon as I get that other spacer with the wrench flats, I will exchange this one, because (like @MattRobertson said) I'd have 'fun times' trying to remove the actual spacer (if I ever need to remove it again).

Next up would be the installation of the new wheels into the frame. I hope that I'll not encounter any more problems, because when installing the original front wheel in the process of unboxing the original bike, I realized that the front wheel had a slight misalignment, although everything was seated correctly in the front dropout. Back then, I feared that the front fork would have been bent somehow, so I had angled the front rim by turning the spokes a bit. Just a jury rig hot fix though...

Edited by 3D-vice
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100 % Legality Project, Reminds me of a song lyric

"The ministry don't worry me my paperwork's alright
They can't touch me, I got my sleep last night
Its knocking out a living wage in nineteen sixty nine
I'm just a thiever, stealing time                                                                                    In the Border Reiver".

 

Mark Knopfler 

https://g.co/kgs/6BC9TQ
 

Edited by Reddy Kilowatt
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I finally got the new wheels installed. It was one hell of a task, because the axis of the new motor was about 10mm wider than the original one, so I had a hard time to widen the rear dropout to fit it in. Well, I got it installed, with some help of my dad.

Also, the new 250W motor works flawlessly and I don't feel any difference to the old 350W motor in regard to torque or speed.

Pictures comming soon!

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Hello Sondors-Hive!

Sorry for the longs absence, I had some busy weeks (all hail self-employment) and not much time to do private stuff. Well, I got my latest work project finished, the bill is paid and I finally have some relaxing days ahead of me.

So I took the opportunity to work on my 100%-Legality Project and did some finishing touches of Stage 1. Just to remind, Stage 1 was to make the bike 100% legal for Germany. The upcoming Stage 2 will be the implementation of a handlebar stem riser and a more comfortable seat with suspension. Stage 3 will be the implementation of a new brake system, and I think I gonna go with a Magura system.

In conclusion, Stage 1 is cleared:

  • New tires and super-wide rims incl. DTSwiss spokes > Check!
  • New 250W Bafang rear hub motor > Check!
  • New high-quality front hub with quick-release axis > Check!
  • New high-quality single-speed freewheel and spacer > Check!
  • New 203mm disc brakes and adjusted brakes > Check!
  • Controller programming adjusted to meet EU regulations and German law > Check!
  • Front and rear lights and reflectors licensed for German road traffic regulations > Check!
  • Wing-Lights nice-to-have addon > Check!

Alrighty, enough technobabble... here are some photos.

SondorsOwnersForum_Bike_Stage1-1.thumb.jpg.1c114862ff8dec34025bcb5dc52192a5.jpg

SondorsOwnersForum_Bike_Stage1-2.thumb.jpg.973a7a25e9c3bda5871711f8bcd2b3f8.jpg

SondorsOwnersForum_Bike_Stage1-3.thumb.jpg.b6116c18ce32f6025d254b59cc4d6c43.jpg

SondorsOwnersForum_Bike_Stage1-4.thumb.jpg.1c686408cf500029a6208c07ea373fcd.jpg

Just to mention: Since the weather is quite crappy and it rains all day, I had to take the pics in my ughly garage. And I had to use a flashlight... apparently, as you can see on the reflectors reflections, lol. I hope that we will have some sunny days ahead for some more beautiful shots.

Edited by 3D-vice
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Another thing I just ordered is a pair of theses foldable locks:

SondorsOwnersForum_Abus.thumb.jpg.475913cd5540221dd14e96474ee4ae5b.jpg

Though I tend to NOT leave my beloved bike parked in public places in my home town... too many thieves out there.

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Daaamn, my absence has been waaay too long! ;) I've been riding my legalized Sondors for the last weeks (gee my butt hurts) and I have decided that it is time for

PHASE 2

of my Sondors Modification Project. Since I am a quite heavy rider, I want to install a seatpost suspension and a more comfortable saddle. I've done some research and I got the following parts to install:

  • Wide leather Saddle
  • Seatpost suspension (appropriate for my weight)
  • Seatpost Cane Creek adapter (27.2 auf 28.6mm)
  • Seatpost Lock

SondorsOwnersForum_Part_Seat.thumb.jpg.ba32bdc1ef2efaf3ddc56ecbe645a7a4.jpg

SondorsOwnersForum_Part_SeatpostSuspension.thumb.jpg.da0fcdf04bc8a914919e93cda02a58e3.jpg

SondorsOwnersForum_Part_SeatpostAdapter.thumb.jpg.9ca327c36c07746a170ea4e597384f36.jpg

SondorsOwnersForum_Part_SeatpostLock.thumb.jpg.28d4160abf96b54c3d3edb63fb8bf1cf.jpg

 

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Welcome back :-)

I just saw the pics you posted at the end of Stage 1.  Dang those 100mm rims coupled to fat tires just make the tire profile incredible.  I think with my next bike build I am going to go that route.  Did you have any issues getting the tire beads to seat on the rims?

As to Phase 2,  I chose that exact seat for my cargo bike: Frankenbike, which at least initially was made up entirely of the parts from my Sondors left over after upgrading.  I had enough to make a whole bike so I did.

I also chose a suspension seatpost, as you did, although I chose a Thudbuster ST in the 27.2 XL size, which gives me a 400mm length.  Between that seat and a suspension post I really liked the ride comfort, as you will I am sure.

I think you are going to be very happy with your choice.  That seat is comfortable and sturdy (pssst... its plastic not leather although it feels nice).  I did however recently change to a Selle Royal Drifter Plus gel saddle.  that saddle is quite a bit softer both from its gel and from its softer spring rate.  I'm reasonably sure I like it.  Reasonably.  I am keeping the original seat in case I decide to switch back.  

Something more for you to consider:  That saddle is inexpensive but the seatpost is not.   Two things you can do to maybe make it a bit tougher to steal.

1. I don't need a quick-release clamp.  I have purchased Thomsen seatpost clamps in the past and they are VERY nice, but also expensive.  I purchased an Axiom Trekk seatpost collar for about 1/3 the cost of a Thomsen.  It works perfectly well.  I do not use the stays for the rack, but I do put 5mm hex bolts in them... possible roadside spares in a future mishap.  

http://a.co/0v2eWBg

2.  Use a seat leash.  Here's the link:  http://a.co/3sdKvoG .  I am providing the link right off because I posted a review there with pics that include installation instructions.  Its second from the top, and the yellow bike in the pics is Frankenbike.  You'll recognize the saddle in the pics. 

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On 16.10.2017 at 5:06 PM, MattRobertson said:

Did you have any issues getting the tire beads to seat on the rims?

Hey man! :) Nope, seating the tire beads went flawlessly. The only issue I had was that they seemed to not sit propperly in the rims, but after inflating the wheels to the appropriate amount of pressure, the beads alligned propperly.

Yeah it was about time to make riding more comfortable. I hope I'll find some time to put the new stuff to my bike, but I have a shitload of work to do (all hail self-employment) and not much sparevtime lately.

I've also thought about replacing the quick-release clamp with a fixed one. I will probably never need to detach the seatpost after I got it adjusted propperly. So > thanks for the useful links! :)

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Yep, I've done it again... Another old thread brought back to life.   So... Phase 3.  Has it happened?  Or is that self employment lark still getting in the way?? 

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On 4/27/2017 at 2:59 AM, 3D-vice said:

@Tabletteer 

Concerning the multi-speed option: It's still an interesting option, as long as I can find a quality 3-speed sprocket. They seem to be hard to find.

 

Let us know if you find a quality 3 speed freewheel, I bought one of the crappy ones and tossed it. I also tossed the stock freewheel, and replaced it with a Shimano. The Shimano has a removal tool, which is nice, I'd like a find a 3 speed with the same quality and with a removal tool.

Edited by nikwax

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Since this thread has come back from the dead, I thought I would put something into it I have figured out in the intervening months on the freewheel spacer:

That stuff I said above with respect to wrench flats and their need so freewheel removal is not a huge problem turned out to be more right than I thought, for a different reason than I thought.

1. The wrench flats allow the removal of the freewheel as expected.  Easy peasy.

2. This was not expected:  I was unable to separate the freewheel spacer from the freewheel after removal from the bike ... the two have frozen together.  I haven't tried putting the spacer in a vise and getting a REALLY Big Wrench to work on the freewheel with, but I used a LOT of force on it with two Really Big Wrenches in hand and got nowhere.  Its possible that the two are not separable and my US$35+shipping freewheel spacer is going to have to be thrown away with the freewheel when it is worn completely out (4000 miles on it and not there yet, but I can see it happening soon... this summer for sure).

So if the thing is disposable, lets not overspend on it.  Ichi Bike has been selling their spacer for some time and when the above thread was going on they were unavailable.

http://www.ichibike.com/product-page/copy-of-ichi-spacer-black

456019_714384d066dc45cdb65efc9f334ac728~

I have had one sitting in my parts box for months and it seems usable enough.  Same dimensions as the EBikeKit spacer.   Just black oxide finish.  US$10 cheaper.  I will make a project of separating out the one I have when it comes off, but in the meantime I will just pull the Ichi Bike spacer from my tool box, attach it to my replacement freewheel (Clickster?) and then attack the old parts at leisure.

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